Making Air Trek

[lightning90]

listen. i need help from all otaku's around the world to make this real. i ain't willing to wait for 100 years to ride an AT.trust me, if all otaku around the world contribute, we can make this real. we all got our own specialty, so give it a try. we can all discuss this.

i already post this on manga updates. but someone asked me to make this thread again here. well, when this thread scatter all over the net, it might prove better chance for making ATs.

(i post it here coz, this is the help forum.XD)

[Nikku]

Do you mean making real AT's? You would need it to be as popular as football (soccer to you Americans) in order to get the proper backing and funding.

A motor on a pair of inline skates would be possible, but it would be nothing like the AT's you know and nothing like as fast.

Sorry to burst the bubble XD

[Vicious]

With where technology is at right now, such a high powered motor would be huge.
There's no way it'd compress to fit into a pair of inline skates...
On top of that, the pressure sensitive motor switch would be expensive, and the whole package would be at least 5000$ to buy.
Of course, safety would be an issue as well, because unlike the characters in manga, even tripping hurts like crazy.

it's just not reasonable...

[White Len]

For this you would need Advanced Physics. I'd say we have about as much of a chance to make a real pair of AT as we would attempt at making our very own Gundam.

[rasenshuriken]

For this you would need Advanced Physics. I'd say we have about as much of a chance to make a real pair of AT as we would attempt at making our very own Gundam.

lol AT's are far less high tech than Gundams, but i get your point ^^

[lightning90]

the reason i brought this thought into the net is coz i'm alone can't figure everything out. online, there's people who good at physics, engineering, etc etc. when we all think together toward the same goal, we're bound for discovery.

come on, there's even in-wheel engine now days.

[rasenshuriken]

making real AT's are only 10 years away...^^
while gundams...i need to borrow some fingers...LOL

[Nikku]

For this you would need Advanced Physics. I'd say we have about as much of a chance to make a real pair of AT as we would attempt at making our very own Gundam.

Walking gundam's have actually been made.....
*goes to find link*

EDIT: http://images.google.co.uk/imgres?imgurl=http://shinymedia.headshift.com/images/images/gundam.png&imgrefurl=http://techdigest.tv/2005/06/walking_gundam.html&h=333&w=200&sz=118&hl=en&start=1&um=1&tbnid=dGnxNeXxyKarCM:&tbnh=119&tbnw=71&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dwalking%2Bgundam%26svnum%3D10%26um%3D 1%26hl%3Den%26client%3Dfirefox-a%26rls%3Dorg.mozilla:en-GB:official%26hs%3DiEe%26sa%3DN

There you go ^^

[rasenshuriken]

Walking gundam's have actually been made.....
*goes to find link*

EDIT: http://images.google.co.uk/imgres?imgurl=http://shinymedia.headshift.com/images/images/gundam.png&imgrefurl=http://techdigest.tv/2005/06/walking_gundam.html&h=333&w=200&sz=118&hl=en&start=1&um=1&tbnid=dGnxNeXxyKarCM:&tbnh=119&tbnw=71&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dwalking%2Bgundam%26svnum%3D10%26um%3D 1%26hl%3Den%26client%3Dfirefox-a%26rls%3Dorg.mozilla:en-GB:official%26hs%3DiEe%26sa%3DN

There you go ^^

lol i saw that, thats...not exactly a gundam, i mean its small, walks at 5 miles per hour and shoots a bb gun...not really energy sword uber cool cannon flying giant 10 inch thick shiny armor gundam material...but its a start...lol ^^

[midorika]

For this you would need Advanced Physics. I'd say we have about as much of a chance to make a real pair of AT as we would attempt at making our very own Gundam.

LOLZ YUNO....

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Okaay... come on people... he didn't know what happened here... so Lolz... give him a break... And Kazu was never online since... That proves how great we are... Lmao...

And lightning... there are a lot of discussions going around about making real ATs... Some funnier ones included... a what --> bottle something bla bla bla...I forgot... It was Yuno who gave the link.

So haha... it's wiser not to talk about it here... Unless... hmm...
you meet up with kazu... he made a character application at the RPG... yeah... he even showed us a draft of his flame regalia in the making...
So if you want... hmm... ...

That's all I got to say... >.<

[lightning90]

this proves it. the guy who asked me to start this thread told me non of this would happen(like any other forums. except for mangaupdate).

making real AT's are only 10 years away...
while gundams...i need to borrow some fingers...LOL

but if nobody worked on it, it won't finish for even 1000 years.

[midorika]

Err... I don't really get what you meant up there... hmmm...

But but... of course, if nobody even make the effort to try... there would be an empty thing.
Heck, I want my personalize gundam mobile suit..
Where? WHERE?

[lightning90]

Err... I don't really get what you meant up there... hmmm...

But but... of course, if nobody even make the effort to try... there would be an empty thing.
Heck, I want my personalize gundam mobile suit..
Where? WHERE?


see? if people just want stuff but noone want to make them, wait for eternity then. it's not gonna be serve infront of you(unless somebody make it).

i for one, refuse to wait. i'll make them myself if i have to. but i also need help. 1 man can't make a difference. that's why i post this thought of making ATs online.so people can gather their thoughts and ideas for 1 goal.

on mangaupdates, there's like 400 post for this topic alone, but all info is mixed up. so we're going for more organize site. i won't post the link here. i'll pm it to those who're interested.

a certain someone from sorascans told me that no people would tease me for making this thread. so i'm just doing him a favor. but i really want to make ATs real. so please. if you're not going to help, don't be in the way(gosh. the same thing i said on mangaupdates).

*edit*
if you want to see the progress of this topic on mangaupdates, here's the link. http://www.mangaupdates.com/showtopic.php?page=1&tid=1623

[White Len]

I think you misunderstand. Shouldn't it be clear to you that people on Airgear is travelling at fast enough speeds to neglect the gravitational pull when they wall climb? For that you'd need one heck of a motor and wheels that create enough friction between the surface and yourself to not fall down and go splat.

Lastly provided you make an AT and sell it to the world. How the hell are ppl going to be able to survive a simple mistake in the air? Theres absolutely no way of protecting yourself from a fall of 10meters let alone 50. When ppl keep dying using your product ppl will want to sue you on a daily basis. Idea? AT is the most impractical convention to ride with.

Your right about how if there is no start theres no ends to achieving a goal. But from the way I look at it, this task of creating a pair of AT is about as difficult as mastering a Kagebunshin Rasenshuriken jutsu and I don't see myself becoming a Hokage class ninja over 5~50years of training. At best for obvious safeties reason, you ride skates on the ground, not flying here and there. Its good to be a die hard fanboy/girl but taking it this seriously is bound to be unhealthy for you. I'm sure you're parents would also disapprove of you attempting a fools errand so I would suggest you drop the operation. You can make friends with the physic genius who was spitting out advanced physics earlier about his flame regalia if you want to but at the end of the day practicality wise, AT just doesn't cut the bill.

[midorika]

YES... lightning... you still have SPM to take this year.... Wait until later.... =_=
Don't hurt or injure yourself till then...

[lightning90]

what we are trying to accomplish is not the actual ATs. it too farfetch. we are merely trying to make something close enough to Ats.

@midorika

this stuf made me interested in physics, chemistry, tech engineering, and computer science. for all i know, this what motivate me to study

[White Len]

Study by all means, 17 is a age you cant be foolishly naive anyhow. Something closer to AT? And how fast do you want this thing to move? How will it slow down? by pressing on your toe? lmao. Too much flaws to make it practical. Try this again when you're in your late 30s plx

[chrollo]

actually lighting's group have made a lot of progress they've found a few motors they make actually work to reach speeds of around 20-30 mph

[midorika]

Hm.... alright alright....
Do try your best at it okay....

But just look at it this way, it is a good debate... so thumbs up to both parties~!! ^^

[smoosh]

yea yea..im not going to poke my nose into this...my phyiscs= fail...good luck with that...

[midorika]

And I'm sure everybody learnt a load from this discussion... It was all for good.
So both thumbs up~!!! ^^
No hard feelings!!

[lightning90]

this calculation is made by one of the holy grail-seeking weirdo.(don't mean it. just being sarcastic)

i found calculate equation might be helped to know what the power needed to move the body & the best place to put a littel genrator into it

the equation is

w*9.81 = Force ''in newton"

so is w=100

force on the leg
will be 981
981N

after analyzing & use equlibrim theory ifound
if we wanna move 100kg on the sket
we need 514500 N to move it

so
"(100*9.81)"981 = 514500
IF YOU Weight are 80 then
981 = 51400 (80*9.81)784.8 = X

SO
514500*784.8/987=X (the power need to move you depend on your weight)
x=40909.1

so if the weight reduce the needed power to move it reduce too

as you see

100kg need 514500 newton to move it 80kg need 40909.1 newton to move it

the guy who did this calculation lives in Kingdom of Saudi Arabia

[Jarnt]

Instead of trying to create AT you got a better chance of trying to create a virtual reality system that could simulate AT

[lightning90]

simulations can't beat the real life. i want the thrill for the speed. i'm thirsty for thrill. we on the team wants to make this real, that we go to the length of making our own forum site. but still plain though.

atleast we tried

*edit*
would you rather have real money or simulated money?

i rather have the real ones. the same aplied for making ATs.

[Seijuro]

thats calculation is totally correct. there is so many other factor you need to put into. but as a base its pretty good. Actually creating at like in air gear is probably near impossible. the speeds they go are faster than some cars. and just the strain on the human body. Not to mention when you fall you die. Cause traveling that fast and hitting pavement would actually kill you. The wall climbing isnt actually all that outrageous though. The fact people can run up walls/ wall ride. its not so ridiculous to htink people could move over 1 storey barriers. But nonetheless climing tropheum tower size compeltely out of hte question. They are motorized rollerblades right now. I have see them. Its kind of like motorized scooters you dont really go all that much fast. its just less work. as for actually functional motorized rollerblades for everyday use. that arent ridiclously heavy thats probably like 10 years down the road. i personally love rollerblading. the feeling you get is the best when you hit high speeds. So i would love to see air trek be actuallized. As for gundams thats a completely different story in itself. We currently have most of hte technology to build a gundam. not as high quality as in like seed or anyhting but one nonetheless. we calculated in physics last year that you would need a nuclear power plant to power a lightsaber. or beam sword but it would be possible. just a huge waste of energy on so many levels. as for the actual ability to move. our robotics get more and more advanced everyday that one with the link is a mobile suit. not a high tech one but one nonehteless. we 10 or 20 years that idea might come to pass. but i think its gonna end up more like the suits in appleseeed. like suits that just assist your movement not huge *** gundams. and htis post just seem really long and disorganized. i didnt show a lot of fact so as you pick this apart since it will happen ill put down what i know more specifically.

[lightning90]

we already got a forum site just for this discusion. we'll take what we can use from here and every other forum i post this, and brought it to the forums for more discussion

and, we're not trying to build actual ATs, just close enough to be a prototype.

[Kazu_Flame_Road07]

My name is Zachary, i am a speed skater in real life. I am 18 and just about to go to college. Lightning90 hit me up and i definetly want to make AT and would dedicate myself and resources to making them. The real reason towards making them would not be just to have them, but to be the first among many Mathematic and engineering people to actually say that their dreams are made into reality.

[rasenshuriken]

My name is Zachary, i am a speed skater in real life. I am 18 and just about to go to college. Lightning90 hit me up and i definetly want to make AT and would dedicate myself and resources to making them. The real reason towards making them would not be just to have them, but to be the first among many Mathematic and engineering people to actually say that their dreams are made into reality.


thatd be awesome if you made them, good luck with it ^^

[lightning90]

good to have you here kazu. i knew you're just the kind of guy we needed.

*edit*

finally the project started. *dance around*

[BlackCat]

yes it whould rock but it whould cost so so much money to Make , like seriously ^^
also welcome Lighting since ive not seen you around.

[lightning90]

yeah. i've never been around here more than 5 minutes. now that i've put this topic here, i'll be visiting everyday.

[BlackCat]

Thats good welcome agean to you .^^

[disgradius]

Well, I'm not going to pretend to be some physics genius or anything cuz I'm not, but I'm having some troubles figuring out where you got your calculations from.

From my knowledge, the force needed to accelerate an object must be greater than the normal force multiplied by the coefficient of friction, which I can't seem to find in the equation (maybe I'm just tired lol, doing physics lab at the same time).

Anyways, the other thing is, if you apply a constant force to the object, unless its equal to the force of friction, you'd be constantly accelerating... so how will cruise control kick in? I think most people would be sick after experiencing sudden acceleration/deceleration repeatedly.

The calculation of your acceleration is really quite simple once you have the coefficient of friction (though it always changes). Its simply equal to your net force divided by your total mass.

Example: coefficient of friction = 0.1
a=Fnet/mass = (Fapplied - Ffriction)/mass
so really for 100kg you would need:
assuming coefficient of static friction = 0.1 (nice easy number)
Fnormal * mu (was that the sp? lol).
100*9.81*0.1=98.1N of force to maintain a constant velocity.
to calculate its acceleration, simply
(Fapplied-98.1)/mass
for 200N force
(200-98.1)/100=1.119m/s^2 (meaning you gain 1.119 meters per second speed every second).

and yes... it would hurt if you hit something...
lets say your mass if 50kg, you're going at maybe... 10m/s? (36km/h)
lets just say you hit a wall and stop... in 0.1 sec? thats 5000N of force jerking you back... (its like being crushed by a 500ish kg object) so...whiplash?

tbh, I think making at's is cool and all but theres more you need to take into consideration. Your footgear has to be able to stand the acceleration of the motor (you don't want to take 30 seconds to speed up do you?) and you need to account for air resistance on the person. Theres a lot more to calculate so your major problem would be finding the right parts and balancing safety with fun. 10m/s is probably about a person running a 100m dash. So if you want to go faster... then watch out.

Sorry if parts of this don't make sense, its kinda late (or should I say early in the morning) lol.

Oh and you can do a better damage report using impulse but I'll leave that for tomorrow or something.

For now, I need to finish my physics lab!

[lightning90]

that's why we're discussing. if not, then we better take a leaf blower and attach it to roller blades.

[Seijuro]

the idea of at is that it is based on on much pressure you put on the blade to depend on how fast it goes. it kind of like be driving a car. You can stay at one speed in a car if you want i dont like too but thats me. What you would have to for the air treks cause make pressure sensitive motors would be a real challenge is have a way to put the blades in coast. like unlock the motor. generally rollerblades dont lose a lot of speed and can coast pretty good if you take care of them. then when you need to go again kick the motor in again. and yes fallling really hurts ive done it on rollerblades but you live to get back up again another day and keep going. though ive never hit a wall you would have to be a real retard to run straight into a wall. on my rollerblades when i go down hills i think i hit between 20-30km/hour. And thats a speed that is still managable. Ideally if i had air treck thats how fast i would want to go. maybe faster if i could but at least that fast. There are some more friction to add the equation theres friction within in actually air treck. and air resistance which sometimes is a lot depending on how you are blading.

[lightning90]

i've checked about the air resistance. we gotta lean forward and focus our weight/mass on the ATs. when we lean, there'll be less air resistance.

[Flonne]

I think this is a unsafe experiment and very costly

[firite]

this calculation is made by one of the holy grail-seeking weirdo.(don't mean it. just being sarcastic)

i found calculate equation might be helped to know what the power needed to move the body & the best place to put a littel genrator into it

the equation is

w*9.81 = Force ''in newton"

so is w=100

force on the leg
will be 981
981N

after analyzing & use equlibrim theory ifound
if we wanna move 100kg on the sket
we need 514500 N to move it

so
"(100*9.81)"981 = 514500
IF YOU Weight are 80 then
981 = 51400 (80*9.81)784.8 = X

SO
514500*784.8/987=X (the power need to move you depend on your weight)
x=40909.1

so if the weight reduce the needed power to move it reduce too

as you see

100kg need 514500 newton to move it 80kg need 40909.1 newton to move it

the guy who did this calculation lives in Kingdom of Saudi Arabia


Technically speaking, this equation w*9.81 = Force ''in newton" refers to gravitational force on objects. The Earth's gravity is 9.81. To make ATs, you will have to negate frictional force as well. The gravitational force will not matter if frictional force is just too big for the AT to move forward. In my opinion, it is possible to make ATs. You could get a pair of rollerblades, and put a motor in it. The main problem will be the amount of time you could ride on it, since the batteries will have to be very small. Furthermore, if you go to speeds of more than 20kph, colliding or falling could have potentially disasterous results.

[Krell]

I would say it is and is not possible to make a pair of AT's.

Well first for it possible it would need a powerfull motor ( not that i would know if it atleady exists).

Not possible because if you don't have a powerfull motor the motor would not be able to move under the weight of a rider, and the force it would apply to the wheels, making them unable to move. Assuming there is not one, or a power supply to provide enough energy for such a motor. I'd believe that it would be quite sometime before such a thing is possible, or if you had some way to making small nuclear energy supplies.

[rasenshuriken]

I would say it is and is not possible to make a pair of AT's.

Well first for it possible it would need a powerfull motor ( not that i would know if it atleady exists).

Not possible because if you don't have a powerfull motor the motor would not be able to move under the weight of a rider, and the force it would apply to the wheels, making them unable to move. Assuming there is not one, or a power supply to provide enough energy for such a motor. I'd believe that it would be quite sometime before such a thing is possible, or if you had some way to making small nuclear energy supplies.

hmm i agree with you, for now that is. I do think though, that it is possible to build a pair of AT's, just not at the moment. Technology has started to become better and better in the past few years, so it is still fairly new. But in the near future, say 10, 20, 30 years, maybe, just maybe there will be a pair of these babys that have been made. lol who knows?

[XenoZiden]

Pretty much this is correct. While it will be possible to Make them in the future. Possibly(50% chance) within the next 10 years. With our current level and Available Technology it is impossible or would cost alot of money to make a single one, Not a pair, one.The motor would be the biggest problem is the fact that it would have to be small, but powerful enough to move a person around.

[rasenshuriken]

hmmm one more thing...
it would be really tricky to learn to use these babys even if they were made...i mean...from zero to what? 20kmph in what? 3? 5 seconds? youd need some serious skill or hardcore training to balance that out...
and the wheels would need to have super grip or something or you would end up doing a backflip instead of going forward...
technology right now is just too young...

[disgradius]

Well, in terms of motors, there are motors that powerful but you need an energy supply for it... which doesn't really fit. I might also add that you would probably throw up after blading around for about 5 mins... sudden acceleration can really nauseate people... Also, if you lean forward to reduce air resistance, how will control your speed if it is dependant upon how you shift your weight?

I don't want to sound discouraging but if it doesn't go fast enough, its like a those motorized roller blades, if it goes too fast then many other issues will arise (for one, if you go constantly at 30km/h you might consider getting goggles to shield your eyes, even the wind will take its toll).

[lightning90]

hmmm one more thing...
it would be really tricky to learn to use these babys even if they were made...i mean...from zero to what? 20kmph in what? 3? 5 seconds? youd need some serious skill or hardcore training to balance that out...
and the wheels would need to have super grip or something or you would end up doing a backflip instead of going forward...
technology right now is just too young...

to prevent sudden speeding, the guys thought it would be better for a kick start. we use our own energy at first, then the engine kicks in.

as seen in anime and manga, ikki sweats and exhausted. proving that this thing require human power too.

[rasenshuriken]

hmm yeah, sounds right. maybe you can make the motor so it doesnt activate until you are at least at 10 kmph, that would be better. It would avoid causing you to do a backflip or loose balance from the sudden rush.

[psio15]

The other problem would be stopping, there would have to be sensors in the roller blades so that when your feet put pressure on a certain point they would cut the engine off and engage the brakes, or just put the engine in reverse... at the moment it's a bit hard to find funding or even come up with the concept but give it 10-20 years than maybe.

[lightning90]

for brake, we thinking of using pneumatic or hydraulic brake system. it'll be best on the back wheel for balance when stoping.

[psio15]

But you'll also have to consider a way to slowly stop the wheels, and have the brake kick in immediatly, so basically you'll have a mini-car brake system on a roller blade....

[godslafco]

As long as you are using kinetic friction and not static friction(like in anti-lock brakes) the problems with slowing down, such as the amount of G's you put on the person and the ATs would decrease drastically.

I like what you're doing Lightning, it's a great start and things like this need to be done if we want ATs in the future.

[lightning90]

i'll try to bring the kinetic friction to the team for discussion. coz i'm not good with physics. they're the one doing the hard work. i'm basically useless. all i do is put them together. T-T

i'll try my best in doing this even if i'm useless

[Tenx]

man.... im not going to use phisics.. cause i believe thats useless for this
sorry... but i do hav a few basic questions for ya....
hav u ever used an inline skate?
hav u ever used a skateboard?

now that u did it... lets dig it a little...

hav u ever give a try to make a grind? a wall ride? or hav jumped in a ramp?

do u know what a half-pipe is?

i do recomend u to :)
just get an skateboard and go down! the feeling that u're looking for is right there... and... as well, u are going to feel the instability of the great speed in human body ...

use a half to jump! grind in rails to feel ur adrenaline...


when u do that.. and broke an arm... or maybe a leg?... hit ur *** on the ground... and hit ur head in the asphalt... then... in the hopsital u will understand what im saying... (i guess xD)


even if the technology grows up in 10 or 20 or even 30 year... the human body would need a million years to make a single change and became a bit more strong(if it change) (unless that u think about using genetics experiments hahaha)


u know... im not saying ur weak or anything.. but.. seeing ur posts and stuffs.. i dont think that u hav ever done such thing...
i skated from my 14yo to my 18/19yo and i still play with my skate... and i do miss my rides in the evening it is for sure a great felling! from the start to the end.... its awesome when u make ur trick right and it is also awesome when u fall.. cause that is a part of it...
the sky that ikki rides.. is just here... ^^


sorry if u hav already destroyed urself with some skate and still want to hit ur head in the wall/floor or be crushed by some car with some crazy equipment....

im not trying to discourage u... i just think that ikki sky's is just there... and that we need to be realistic about what we plan to do...

to be honest... it would be awesome if human body could be strong enough to be able to wear AT.. but we must live in the real world. ^^


ps.: gundams seems to be much more real than AT's since inside of it we can hav a safety capsule and etc...

[lightning90]

another one....

shouldn't be suprised..

[Tenx]

@ light90

its a real question.. i really want to know if u evar used an skateboard? and if u tried to get some real speed with it?... and all the other stuff....

:)
please answer me ^^


. i've all the 5 pages (now 6) of this thread and i didnt find this in ur posts... :)

[psio15]

I used to skate, and I totally agree with you man, but you know it would be freakin awesome to have AT's (although I would bust my butt a lot more than I do now...) By far skating gives you some of the best thrills, and I agree, there is a sky of sorts in our world, but motorized roller blades would be an awesome thrill, you have to admit that much!

[Tenx]

yup.. i agree with that... if the human body could handle it.. ^^
it would really be AWESOME... but for now... at least my body, cant take it xD hahahah

[psio15]

I agree, I think I'd end up in the hospital within, oh about 10 seconds!! The idea behind it all sounds awesome, but the human body proably won't be able to handle to much of it. I can proably handle up to around 20 mph, but you'll have to do it on a freaking smooth surface, or you'll break your nose. If you guys do pull it off though, I'd love to seem some videos of you guys riding!

[lightning90]

i put on a rollerblade, hold onto a bike, moving at 60km/h, fall down 12 times.... and look, i'm still typing. it's a miracle!! duh

[Tenx]

a bike... at 60km/h ?
and u fell 12 times?

ok.. now i ask u...

do u know the difference between what u did.. and an the AT u want to build?
AND the difference between hold on something to get some speed and make tricks?

one more.. plz... really... plzzzzz
make a video when u decide to do that again.. ^^


ok! ok!.. dont waste ur time with me anymore...

we know that some fellows can fall from their bikes at 200km/h and dont die..


video plz!

[psio15]

one more.. plz... really... plzzzzz
make a video when u decide to do that again.. ^^
video plz!

Holy crap yes! Oh, and you fell 12 times? Dang you must be stronger than Chuck Norris! Anyways, if you could post a video that would be amazing! I would love to see this in action.

[lightning90]

1 prob though, i don't have a cam. as soon as i steal one, i'll record it.

i do that to test whether we can stand on AT if it's moving on 60km/h. for the first 4 times, i fell as soon as i let go the bike, the next 8, it took me awhile to fell, the 13th time's the charm. i can stand until it slow enough for me to stop.
tore up my fav jeans in the process T-T

if you don't believe on what we're trying to achieve, then don't. nobody forcing you.just at least don't discourage us. the stuff you said, even if you didn't mean to, it's discouraging.

[Tenx]

^^
well... i dont mean to actually discourage u guys.. but..
i do believe that the sky u are looking for is right in front of u and u just cant see it.. ^^

maybe im just gettin ur idea wrong...

what do u really plan to do with ur AT?
just run with it?
or do u plan to use it for jumps and wall rides and making tricks?

theres a huge abyss between these two goals...

my beliefs are out of question.. cause.. who am i to doubt ur words?... if u are saying that and its not true.. it'll be only ur problem.. not mine ^^


please.. dont feel discouraged with my posts... i might be a bit cruel sometimes... but thats the reality that i see, and it hurts sometimes ^^... if i come to u and say "good luck with ur project" but actually i just think that this is going to nowhere... i'll be just a ramdom jerk with an useless comment ^^
when i asked u about all those question of half-pipes skates and stuff.. it was for real... and i really want u to try to use a half-pipe..... i believe that there is something that u might be looking for... cause... Air Gear is a fantasy made by rasing the felling of a Skater/InlineSkater to an unreal place where u can reach only in ur head..
Resuming the Air Gear Felling is real, while AT's are unreal ^^


if i thought that u are some completely stupid guy i wouldnt hav wasted my time posting here... /o/:cool:

[lightning90]

what i want is speed. no bikes, no car, just the thing on my feet for the high speed thrill.

[Nikku]

what i want is speed. no bikes, no car, just the thing on my feet for the high speed thrill.

High speed? Buy some Recs/speed skates, then hit the hills. Trust me, you'll easily get up to a speed that's beyond your control.

[evilmonkeychild]

Okay, I want to ride Ats just as much as the next person, but there's no way true, Air Gear quality ATs would ever be put into production. I mean, I'm sure there's a way to make physics work to your advantage and create them, but there are way more factors than just that in play.

Firstly, no company would expend the money to make ATs because they're too much of a liability. Skates that allow people to be able to jump from rooftops to the ground and ride along the sides of buildings will incur lots and lots of death. The survival rate of such a product would be considerably less than the death rate. I mean, think about, in a pool of a hundred random people, how many actually excel at skate boarding and roller blading. Think about all the kids who would take up ATs because they think they're cool and then make one tiny mistake and die. There's no way any sensible company would take risks like those. In addition, the cost to create something like ATs would be tremendous to both the consumer and producer. Very few people would buy them because of the price tag alone.

Then, on a more abstract basis, think about the Air Gear universe and the gang problems related to ATs. The destruction and violence associated with ATs would instantly get them banned in most major cities and countries.

I'm not saying that I dislike the idea of ATs, I just think that you should approach this realistically by looking at ALL the factors, not just the science involved. Sure, they can theoretically be created, but what about the social impact of such a device? I think that you should look at creating a similar device that's not as powerful as an AT but has similar features that would be permissible in society.

[psio15]

The gang issue would not relate back to the real world, well in my opinion that is. Gangs have plenty of options open at the moment such as, actual roller blades, skateboards, mopeds, motorized scooters, and most importantly cars. I highly doubt that AT's would be banned becuase of their association with gangs. If I were in a gang and trying to commit a crime I would feel safer riding in a car than on motorized roller blades, but then again that's my opinion. If you feel safer being shot at outside a metal shell rather than in something that could possibly save your life, than I guess there will be a problem. The social impact could be just as big as those motorized machines that were supposedly going to be a big hype (can't remember the name right now, it was refered to as "it" before the release). All the thing does is help you travel around a bit faster according to how you move your muscles (you can see an example in the White and Nerdy video when Al rides through the park). I just don't see how AT's would cause such a tremor in our society, seeing no one can withstand, or stay in control, with the speeds that are attained in the manga.

[evilmonkeychild]

There's a vast difference between segways ( I think that's what you're talking about) and ATs. ATs can reach speeds faster than cars, those things can't
Nor can they jump or ride up buildings. I'm pretty sure that making anything close to ATs would be much more dangerous than any of those portable motorized vehicles like segways. For starters, people would be using ATs in skate parks and trying to do tricks. Plus, I'm not saying that people would be able to manufacture real, true-to-manga ATs. I was just giving a hypothetical situation to prove that not only would ATs be impossible to produce/ride, but they would also be difficult to integrate into society. Which is why I say that Lightning90 is going to have to settle for something significantly less than the real thing.

[blankie]

i think u can do it and i can say that i'm impressed definitely going to be a awesome project for u guys, but consider wat type of physical condition u would have to be to effectively use AT's (don't think a skinny kid gonna cut) take any1 from airgear they're all pretty ripped jus one thing to consider(cause at's are part motorized /part human power'd)by way wat are guys gonna use 2 power it (don't think a duracells gonna cut it)


otherwise GL to u guys

[Nikku]

i think u can do it and i can say that i'm impressed definitely going to be a awesome project for u guys, but consider wat type of physical condition u would have to be to effectively use AT's (don't think a skinny kid gonna cut) take any1 from airgear they're all pretty ripped jus one thing to consider(cause at's are part motorized /part human power'd)by way wat are guys gonna use 2 power it (don't think a duracells gonna cut it)


otherwise GL to u guys

I like this guy xD
Duracell AT's FTW. :lol:

[lightning90]

you know... it is impossible to put an engine that small into ATs(in real world) and expect it to be faster than a car....

we're humans too... so we don't plan on making a screaming footwear death trap....

our goal for the moment right now is prolly 60 kph.... not 180 kph....

going above 70 km/h on ATs are a suicidal act...for the moment.. can't stand on 70kph...tried that...
60kph is good however...

fast enough.... but not lethal....unless you're stupid enough to copy the manga and jump off building.....

we're making it for the speed.... not for the jump....

about the power source... we're planning on using lithium polymer batteries...

oh yeah... forgot to say... read system is the only thing easy enough...and it's in test period... it's connected to hacked psp and nokia 9300...

the engine is the monstrosity to handle.... can't look for engine that powerful online... have to make it ourselves....

sorry about the .... i'm pretty discourage now....by the hell called exam....

brakes-disc brake system
battery- li-poly batteries
engine-....still on the prob board..
frame-kazu had it covered....i guess...
what else..? i forgot....

we wont hold production coz of what people might do with it....at least i wont... bike is for transportation... but i used it for illegal street racing... so is it the bike's company fault?...

i'm tired...of hearing "you can't...it's impossible...what!!? no way...." stuff....

i just want to ask for a favor... if you don't want to ride it(when it's finished), then don't.... i'm not gonna kill you if you don't ride it... you got free will... and so do i.... i want to make this real... so help me....or get out of the way....

some guy once said..."when there's a will, there's a way"....

sorry about the long post... i'm a little too close to being an emo right now....

who wouldn't? after hearing that your life just got shortened....

[Nikku]

"bike is for transportation... but i used it for illegal street racing"

I don't know if this is sarcasm or not......but if it isn't, this is really funny xD

[lightning90]

glad to see my down-ness able to make something funny...

[Nikku]

glad to see my down-ness able to make something funny...

Well, im not stopping you from trying. I just think it's got too many problems. If you mange to make them, i'll take my hat off to you. But until then....you can get speed from recs, and do tricks on aggressive skates.

[lightning90]

it's not about speed and tricks alone...

it's about what you desire.... it's what i'm aiming for....

sometimes....aiming for the impossible what makes it possible...

electricity...internet...cars....bikes....ice cream....

think about it....electricity was once impossible....but one man determination changed it all....

so basically....it's impossible if none tried to make it possible....

[Nikku]

"it's about what you desire.... it's what i'm aiming for...."

That sounds so cliche from an anime character xD
- What is it you desire to do with them?

[lightning90]

"the destination is not important...it's the journey what's count"

just to be able to make them is all i want.... then to ride it to my doom won't hurt...

[Nikku]

"the destination is not important...it's the journey what's count"

just to be able to make them is all i want.... then to ride it to my doom won't hurt...

How much of the materials do you have at the moment? Just out of curiosity...

[lightning90]

still looking for the mold shop...

gotta search for engine...that's the only thing stands in our way....

*bang head on table*

[midorika]

^ don't you have to study for the exams????
Lolz. This is like off. but, how're is the exam? good?

Still, good luck with everything that you're planning to do.

[lightning90]

rika!!! haven't seen you in awhile.. kinda miss you really ...j/k

the exams is fairly easy... for this week at least... physic...chemistry...add math... all of those came from hell...

[bigal78]

Sorry for asking...but I've done a little bit of research of making my own in prior to reading this thread. Where are you going to get enough torque to allow you to go from a non-moving position to ~20mph? Also about the lithium polymer batteries...I did some calculation on that with a motor that had 1600rpm's, that would fit in a shoe/skate (though i found out it didn't have near enough torque), and a 3pack batteries that had 11.7 volts and 3700 mAh, it would only power the motor for a single minute...unless I did something wrong.

Personally, I was thinking of taking a...magnetic...approach to things, not going to say what because I can't confirm it will work/be practical.

[darkpaul181]

bigal78 i was thinking about the enregy too and for sure it would not last like 1-2 minutes, so to make this work we could make a generator, BUT to build a generator that fit in the AT(a very small generator) that can generate the necessary energy with it's small size is still kind of not impossible but for us is still impossible...,and the impact when you land would left "scars" on it and eventually breaking.
So i've thinked in another way like you said with MAGNETIC, i remembered a product that is still selling abroad named PowerBall (www.powerballs.com), i don't know if you guys know this, it's a ball inside a very sealed plastic shell(to no escape) that is activated by Magnectism and it can twist around 15.000 rpm! to even more!. "You set this rotor in motion using a cord or your finger and build its speed by subtle rotation of the wrist. It contains no motor or no batteries. All of the energy which we describe below comes from you dear reader and the stronger you are, the faster you will be able to make your NSD Powerball spin!".
So what we can do is search a way to make the ball roll forward and with the strenght and pressure of our feet and leg, and a way to the ball always cycle it's movement to not lose speed! :)

This is a powerball:http://news.softpedia.com/images/reviews/large/Powerball_13-large.jpg
Ohh and i found this, i don't know if it will help with any ideas...http://www.powerballs.com/images/product_images/Foot%20Trainer.jpg
Description: Unleash the might of Powerball on your legs!

Given the overwhelming results which have been seen with the use of Powerball for arm training, conditioning and rehabilitation you can see now how the same principle of exercise can be used so effectively in training your feet and legs.

Simply start your Powerball and place it in the Foot Trainer for an amazing workout on your feet, ankles and legs.

[DragonGaze]

I was thinking about this recently too, it's interesting to see how far you guys have thought this through. Some points I came up with (aside from the obvious problem of the motor) were more along the safety side of things, for instance:


--If you were to jump in these things, as soon as there was no resistance on the motor, the wheels would either start using all the energy of the motor, thus landing you at a much higher rpm than you jumped, or because of the fact that all pressure would be removed from the AT at the point of jumping, the wheels would pretty much instantly go to 0 rpm due to the motor stopping. Come to think of it, this would happen even just removing one foot of the ground... making it even more dangerous.

Only way I could think of fixing this is having some way to remove the 'pressure' applied by the motor on the wheel (i.e. have the wheels go in to a free spin) when the pressure is below a certain point, perhaps if you're planning on having the motor only 'kick in' at a certain speed, it can be at the pressure for that speed (in fact you'd probably have to do that by taking the pressure, so as to take the input factor rather than the outputted one). I'm sure there are other points this'd be useful too, can't think of any right now though :P

In-Post Edit: When the power runs out, wheels would lock up in some cases. Not good.


--Emergency Stop. This is a big one, cause at any speed, if something goes wrong, you gotta stop quickly. Having it as part of the skate's controls would make it too intricate, and too easy to accidentally trip. Having it on the outside of the skates would mean having to bend down to activate it... but having it by hand would be the easiest way. Perhaps somehow off the top of the boot part? I dunno.


I'm sure I came up with more, but it's now way after 12am, and I have uni tomo...today, so I'll stop for now.

Hope that gave some thoughts though :P

[bigal78]

bigal78 i was thinking about the enregy too and for sure it would not last like 1-2 minutes, so to make this work we could make a generator, BUT to build a generator that fit in the AT(a very small generator) that can generate the necessary energy with it's small size is still kind of not impossible but for us is still impossible...,and the impact when you land would left "scars" on it and eventually breaking.
So i've thinked in another way like you said with MAGNETIC, i remembered a product that is still selling abroad named PowerBall (www.powerballs.com), i don't know if you guys know this, it's a ball inside a very sealed plastic shell(to no escape) that is activated by Magnectism and it can twist around 15.000 rpm! to even more!. "You set this rotor in motion using a cord or your finger and build its speed by subtle rotation of the wrist. It contains no motor or no batteries. All of the energy which we describe below comes from you dear reader and the stronger you are, the faster you will be able to make your NSD Powerball spin!".
So what we can do is search a way to make the ball roll forward and with the strenght and pressure of our feet and leg, and a way to the ball always cycle it's movement to not lose speed! :)


Well the problem with that idea is how much power will it have? Large amounts of RPM are nice, but its good to have some kind of power behind it to be able to push, the torque.



--If you were to jump in these things, as soon as there was no resistance on the motor, the wheels would either start using all the energy of the motor, thus landing you at a much higher rpm than you jumped, or because of the fact that all pressure would be removed from the AT at the point of jumping, the wheels would pretty much instantly go to 0 rpm due to the motor stopping. Come to think of it, this would happen even just removing one foot of the ground... making it even more dangerous.

Only way I could think of fixing this is having some way to remove the 'pressure' applied by the motor on the wheel (i.e. have the wheels go in to a free spin) when the pressure is below a certain point, perhaps if you're planning on having the motor only 'kick in' at a certain speed, it can be at the pressure for that speed (in fact you'd probably have to do that by taking the pressure, so as to take the input factor rather than the outputted one). I'm sure there are other points this'd be useful too, can't think of any right now though :P

In-Post Edit: When the power runs out, wheels would lock up in some cases. Not good.


--Emergency Stop. This is a big one, cause at any speed, if something goes wrong, you gotta stop quickly. Having it as part of the skate's controls would make it too intricate, and too easy to accidentally trip. Having it on the outside of the skates would mean having to bend down to activate it... but having it by hand would be the easiest way. Perhaps somehow off the top of the boot part? I dunno.


Yes, there would have to be a way for them to achieve free spin, but that can be quite simple because if you make a jump there will be no pressure being applied, save the amount to make the jump (which would cause you to go faster), unless you went off a ramp. Landing would be a problem, as that would cause a good amount of pressure, and accelerating quickly on a landing isn't always what you want to do. But that can most likely be adjusted so that the motor doesn't jump all of a by sudden wanting to go twice the speed it was previously going. Also I don't think having the motor geared to the axle would be a good idea, in case of a motor failure you would always want to be able to use the wheels, like regular rollerblades. Freespin besides when accelerating would be best in my opinion, that way you would only need to apply pressure when you want to go faster, or apply pressure in shorter bursts to maintain a general speed.

And about the emergency brake, you would probably be better off just falling over, than making the wheels lock up...it would make you fall over anyways at higher speeds but at least it would be controlled. You'd get hurt, but most likely not killed unless you go headfirst (who would?) I'd rather get scraped up by forcing a fall than applying an emergency brake that could cause my to lose balance and force to fall forward on my face.

[§Migz101§]

Hey guys love th e idea
and have too though about the financial problems but in a way if you can get a sponcer from some tech company

I was at the wired fest(im from LA) and this is possible because the kick start would let you control the speed in a way.
so good luck
"Be the man to make the impossible possible"
-Gundam Seed

[lightning90]

we do planning on to put the wheels on free spin when we're jumping.
kick start is something vital for our technologies so far.

p/s:sorry if my post too short. my internet connection is't too good right now, so i got little time to be online.

[Jakkin]

Good luck. Got my support on this... I'd love to trade in my inlines for AT's.

[psio15]

For the emergency break you must consider that you can power slide to a stop, turn your body perpendicular to the direction of your velocity. It's not the best idea, and you can also turn sharply enough to slow you down as well, that is if you can cut the motor in time. There are other ways to slow down and stop rather than using breaks that cause you to visit the hosipital more than 3 times a week! The gyroball looks awesome though! What's your budget for this project anyways? I'm sure that if you pull this off everyone in the forum will be begging you to make one for them!!

[UnseenDeath]

well from wat i see with all ur math its all correct. and the power source although i dont completely understand it i can see where it could work really well.

Im going to be a Mechanical engineer so tensions and etc. are kinda were im specializing. Currently we dont have the tech to make the skates that small (slim) with out sacrficing speed and efficency. I dont think that part could hold up to the tension of a 150 pound person and accelerating at a speed of 20 mph right off the bat. the mechics is most definetly possibly it would actually have similar stress testing to the play station control. (idk if ppl kno what i mean by that) when the play station 2 was set out on the market there was a big hyph because their controller could sense the amount of force being put upon them. the harder that you push the button the faster you would go in the game. this would be very similar to the acceration button that is needed for the device to kno when u go. this would also be placed toward the front of the feet (not the toes but the place were ur toes connect totally cant remeber the name) this area of ur foot has the most force of the rest of ur foot when u are walking or putting your weight forward. the oppsite is needed for the heel of the foot in order to provide a stopping mechendice. how were similar to a car, it cant be activated at the same time as the acceration due to it would lead to the instant burn out of the gear and etc.

[Phelen]

It's called the ball of the foot, Death...lol
The stress testing would be a nightmare.... But starting with a bulkier version might bring more insight into later versions...kinda like a glorious failure (one that you learn a lot from)

I'm afraid the other problem with the Powerball is the transfer of the rotation of the power ball and getting to power the wheels (as it is encased in plastic) and while that could be worked around easily enough, the rotation of the ball isn't necessarily unilateral rotation. The site says that it has decent torque, but would it still work after being attached to the wheels and how would the initial momentum be provided? A separate motor or by someone actually picking up the leg and rotating it? Not a bad idea, though. Perhaps a separate low powered motor could be used to start the ball rolling (pun intended) and save on energy consumption of the A-Ts.

As for the emergency break, I concur with the idea of not needing one. A better idea would be an emergency motor cut-off in case of over-sensitivity or a jammed weight sensor.

[Eberwolf]

I've been working in my shop, trying to create actual ATs. It's actually going well. I'm only having two issues. A fully-functioning internal brake and accelerator and getting them to travel over 15 mph. As for design, they are pretty close to the Air Gear versions. I'll post a picture when I get a little further.

[Jakkin]

I've been working in my shop, trying to create actual ATs. It's actually going well. I'm only having two issues. A fully-functioning internal brake and accelerator and getting them to travel over 15 mph. As for design, they are pretty close to the Air Gear versions. I'll post a picture when I get a little further.

Proof? Can we see your blueprints and whatnot.

I'm a skeptic, and the main problem I see with AirTrecks becoming a real thing.

Is:

1. Battery Source.
2. Cooling System.
3. Pressure-based motor system.
4. Breaking System.

[psio15]

I'm also a bit of a skeptic, although I would love to see this happen! I dunno if he'll have blueprints, some people just make things without drawing them out on paper. The battery source doesn't really bother me, I'm not sure why it bothers you, besides the fact that it will overheat without a cooling system. It just seems that AT's will be very bulky and by the sound of it they'll end up way high off the ground. I just don't see how you can fit all of the necessary parts into a rollerblade.

[lightning90]

if we put stuff into a roller blade, we end up with nothing more than a modified roller blade. we need all the functioning parts, then make a frame for it. then a cover so it doesn't look crappy. start from scratch, not modifying an existing roller blade..

[UnseenDeath]

Has anyone thought of the heat the at the batter or w,e battery that we use as well as the parts that would be used for acceration. the heat from the gears and etc. would not have a good way to cool unless through the skate its self causing it unbearbly hot for whom evers foot is in the skate. It would also cause the gear and etc to break down insanely fast

[Jakkin]

I'm also a bit of a skeptic, although I would love to see this happen! I dunno if he'll have blueprints, some people just make things without drawing them out on paper. The battery source doesn't really bother me, I'm not sure why it bothers you, besides the fact that it will overheat without a cooling system. It just seems that AT's will be very bulky and by the sound of it they'll end up way high off the ground. I just don't see how you can fit all of the necessary parts into a rollerblade.

Hence why the battery is a problem.. it's the size, there isn't a battery on the market that is small enough but still powerful enough to do any of the things necessary that AT's should do... It's all a matter of size to power ratio...

[Eberwolf]

I already said I'd post the information when they're more complete. When they're finished I'm going to make a video of the first run. However, I'm pretty far from that. And as for cooling, it has a greatly modified, double liquid cooling system from my old Alienware computers. My ITT-Tech teacher helped me make that though. None of it is assembled, but I have a lot of the components and the shell is being remolded, because the first ones couldn't withstand the internal motors. I'm not releasing anymore information than that, because it's my design and I'm protective of it.

Oh, and Jakkin, you aren't quite right. There isn't a battery, released to the average public, powerful enough. That's all I'll say there. Also, I already said "3. Pressure-based motor system." and "4. Breaking System." were issues. I'm working on it. We have two Ph.Ds working on it. As well as 8 students, including me.

[UnseenDeath]

ah good idea with the liquid cooling never thought of that. ^^

[psio15]

There isn't a battery, released to the average public, powerful enough. That's all I'll say there.

Hmmm, sounds afwfully suspicous to me.... sounds cool too! If you get this working that'll be freaking amazing! It does sound like you are hinting that you have some sort of uber-battery hidden at your house or something to that extent. Do you work for the government? Actually don't answer that question, I'd like to live, thanks! :P

[lightning90]

why does when issue about working for the government always followed up with "if i tell you, i'll have to kill you" stuff?

eberwolf, i know you're protective about your design and all. and i'm guessing it would be for the trade rights when you've done it right?

but can you gave us a pointer or something. thanks about the liquid cooling system. we haven't thought about that. i'll brought it to the forums.

[Seijuro]

isnt that 3 problems but. generally speaking 15 mph is probably a good speed for ats. I mean fast would be great an all but for marketing it anyfaster would kill beginners. Ultimately you would only be appealing to good bladers. Any fast would cause problems for most people. I am assuming you are using rollerblades as a base. Have you seen those slanted two wheel skates with larger wheels. You could outfit those to make them motorized. the wheels are large enough that you could put a small motor on the side. elimanating the need for an internal motor. and a emergency cutoff or pressure sensitive accerlator in your hand would be sufficient to start. Then just use a regular roller blade brake. of sorts or however those special skates stop im not sure off the stop of my head. generally most people need brakes to stop like on the back. having a break that stops the wheel lead to offbalance and people falling. Experience bladers can powerslide but not at extremely high speeds. unless you real good. I did it once by fluke and it still resulted in me falling just not on my head. I in aerospace engineering so i do that same stuff as unseen death. and making an internal break also creates undue and unessary stress. a true at is many year away from functionality but something like a motorized scooter on rollerblades could be do able relatively soon.

[Eberwolf]

My father and my wife work for the government. lol
And yes, I'm protective for the rights. I plan on trying to market them, or sell them to Oh! Great to market.
And as for pointers, be determined. Don't let anyone stop you. ATs deserve to be real! It's up to our generation to bring them into reality. As for pointers about making them, I have none, I found many people who were interested in my idea. Then we brainstorm. So I guess my main advice is to find others who can help you.

To Seijuro:
And no, I am not using rollerblades as a base.

[bigal78]

Just because he says its not available to the average public doesn't mean that he can't get them, without working for the government. It just means he is either: a) certified to use them, or b) has the right hookups that allow him access to more powerful (and obviously more dangerous) technology.

Brakes aren't a problem, I'd rather have a forced fall than an artificial one on rollerblades, cutting the engine would be enough as previously stated.

Power supply is a problem, you would need a substantial amount of energy to power the next problem.

Motors! Go find a small motor capable of reaching speeds of 15 mph, with enough torque to actually have it push a human weighing in the 100-150ish weight range(can't really go higher, as the motors would just keep getting larger and larger). Theoretically, it would have to be a high input high output motor, because there is no way i could see that would be efficient enough to have medium or lower input at high output.

Splody power supply isn't a good idea either, and an extension cord isn't practical(though most likely the one that would work best). We'd hopefully would just need to put them into a chamber and vent the excess heat out the back. Can't really say more about that cause i don't know more about it.

And wheels...since now that there is going to be power directly in the wheels, instead of them getting help from the user as in conventional roller blades, they'd have to be of good quality, wouldn't want them to wear thin in a week but still want good enough traction so you wouldn't slide everywhere (hehe...).

I have ideas, but until I am entirely sure about how practical it would be, I wouldn't go around sharing them either. Anyways, posting that you're trying gives you an incentive to work more because you don't want to let everyone down...and people are anxious for you to finish, but not rush it. Plus discussion is good.

[rasenshuriken]

hmmms, im not too good on this subject
but for an energy supply, couldn't you just have battery packs around your waist? it would be hell of a lot easier at the moment.
not too sure...

[Eberwolf]

Currently, my design uses to battery packs in each skate. These are attached to the skate shells. Which are still being remade.... Eberwolf is displeased at the time it is taking. The batteries need to be charged after running at full for 8 hours. This is going to vary based on the individual's weight. I'm still working on extending the time without making the skates too heavy. That is quite difficult. And I'm sticking to the design from Air Gear. I want to stay true to the vision. Anywho, I'm going to be away from my shop for the holidays. Visiting my in-laws. So, I probably won't be making any advances for awhile. Though maybe I'll get my shells in. :grrrrrr:

[thenecessity]

cant wait until its done, this is soundin really interesting

[Jakkin]

why does when issue about working for the government always followed up with "if i tell you, i'll have to kill you" stuff?

eberwolf, i know you're protective about your design and all. and i'm guessing it would be for the trade rights when you've done it right?

but can you gave us a pointer or something. thanks about the liquid cooling system. we haven't thought about that. i'll brought it to the forums.

For the same reason that we could have the gas problem fixed, but we won't because the oil companies have a strangle-hold on the car companies...

There was a man in El Paso that 'disappeared' after inventing a gas system that used less than a gallon of gas and made it last for 1 million miles.

[Jakkin]

For the same reason that we could have the gas problem fixed, but we won't because the oil companies have a strangle-hold on the car companies...

There was a man in El Paso that 'disappeared' after inventing a gas system that used less than a gallon of gas and made it last for 1 million miles.

Currently, my design uses to battery packs in each skate. These are attached to the skate shells. Which are still being remade.... Eberwolf is displeased at the time it is taking. The batteries need to be charged after running at full for 8 hours. This is going to vary based on the individual's weight. I'm still working on extending the time without making the skates too heavy. That is quite difficult. And I'm sticking to the design from Air Gear. I want to stay true to the vision. Anywho, I'm going to be away from my shop for the holidays. Visiting my in-laws. So, I probably won't be making any advances for awhile. Though maybe I'll get my shells in. :grrrrrr:
I have a shell blueprints... I'm just not sure what metal and a covering material would be best suited. I'd love to use that Dragonskin material... have you seen that on Futureweapons... Wonderful stuff, our police swatteam in town have it... It's light and durable enough for AT's in my opinion.

Also, please refrain from making threats along the nature of 'if i tell you you have to die' I'm highly doubtful you have the resources to pull off a stunt of that nature.
Aff Double Post.

*Slits wrists*

[lightning90]

arigato~

you guys(possibly girls too) have given me much help.
thanks!!

now to take all your suggestion away.
you won't mind me taking the ideas you've posted won't you?

[Jakkin]

Go for it. I'm just a blue-print designer. And only a lame one at that.

[Whisp]

For this you would need Advanced Physics. I'd say we have about as much of a chance to make a real pair of AT as we would attempt at making our very own Gundam.

even though making a gundum would be awesome at's are closer to being true than alot of people think

[Eberwolf]

Nobody made a threat. lol.

And to lightning: if you use the cooling system, please let me talk to my team. We may just give you the schematics, if we work together.

[lightning90]

i'm down with it.
my objective of making this thread is for us to work together toward the same objective.

[darkpaul181]

Hey guys about the "metal" that are going to be used in AT what about "airplane aluminium" it's very light and resistent :)...

hope the AT will get live soon!

[UnseenDeath]

aluminum is an ok metal but it needs to be something that is more resistant. Aluminum has a tendencey if not made correctly to be to bendable not sturdy enough to use for something that ur putting large amounts of pressure on. i would say Titanium but that would make this project 20 times more explencive. as long as it sturtly.

[Eberwolf]

Yeah I'm experimenting with metals. It's difficult. I'm on my second metal. We'll see how it goes. I'm thinking of trying a plexi-glass next. Still unsure.

[UnseenDeath]

plexi-glass is amazing. cant heat it 2 long cas it weakens it. that and makes it bubble and it looks bad. but other than that i am a huge fan of plexi glass its one of the most handy materials around the engineering class.

[Eberwolf]

Oooo... okay thanks for he info. saves me some cash.

[Arakawa]

Don't mind me asking if the question has already been asked (I'm not looknig through 12 pages..) but how would you implement a braking system? It's hard enough for regular people to brake with inlines, but braking on a system that uses a pressure system to accelerate?

[Seriesta]

Yay! I'm so happy that there are people out there who are trying to make ATs. Best of luck to all of you !

I'll love to help out, but unfortunately I really suck in physics, mechanical stuff and etc...:oops: I hope you guys don't mind if I ask some noob questions about the progress from time to time. Good luck again. I'll really love to see this happen! :D

[bigal78]

Don't mind me asking if the question has already been asked (I'm not looknig through 12 pages..) but how would you implement a braking system? It's hard enough for regular people to brake with inlines, but braking on a system that uses a pressure system to accelerate?

A power-slide would be easier than brakes themselves, as implementing breaks into rollerblades that wouldn't throw the user upon use would be....hard, and most likely painful. And I'd rather force my own fall, than get an artificial one from the brakes. You'd still get scraped up, but less chance of a major injury if you know how to fall. Best way to stop though would be to just either fall, or not use the engine and turn in a circle or whatever to slow down naturally.

[lightning90]

disk brake system on the back wheel to slow it down..
so power slide won't be so fatal.

it's still a theory.. i think..

[Bluemarine]

Sorry and not meaning to offend, But this is a terribly idiotic idea, The fact of simply making them is idiotic, not thinking about the crazily stupid idea of being able to ride them, just trying to get past 30 - 40km would knock you on your head, thats is if the torque of accelerating hasn't already done so...
Maybe it could be plausible to ride them if the wheels stretched half a meter back and forward for a lot more stability, and you are crouched the whole time, but hey that wouldn't be riding A-T's now would it?

Soz if I offended ya ;)
Bluey~

[Eberwolf]

Bluemarine, you offend. You came into the WRONG forum to say crap like that. That's like going to a gay pride thing and saying. "I'm sorry, but you're all going to Hell. I apologize if I offend anyone." I mean come on. And I already made a point of saying that my ATs will not exceed 15mph(like 24.1 kph) And it's all in how you stand. Current rollerbladers can go and excess of 15mph and not fall. So get the facts and think before you speak. And no, I'm not even remotely phased by your comment. ATs WILL exist. Thank you and goodnight.

[Tenx]

we need pics

/o/

(this is not a flood xD)

[bigal78]

Bluemarine, I bet you would be one of those people who would have said "flying machines wouldn't work" a while back too. Just because its something new doesn't mean it can't happen. If you think the torque will knock you back, then how come going 60MPH on a motorcycle doesn't break your legs/any other part of you body. According to you, the force would cause you to fall off, right? Or if you don't fall off, the strain would surely break somehting, right?
Point being, don't go around telling people what they are doing is impossible, because even though it may seem that way to you, maybe not everyone else thinks the same, and discouraging innovation is always a bad thing.

[UnseenDeath]

we arent talking about going 60 mph we are more of talking about going 20 or under... being perstimistic and not looking to expand ur views on modern reality then nothing gets made. There are a certain amount that ur body can hold up to. its called physics and there are equation and testings that have been done by biomedical engineers that involve inventions of this sort. It is not that it is not there, it is finding it./~

[Jakkin]

Bluemarine, you offend. You came into the WRONG forum to say crap like that. That's like going to a gay pride thing and saying. "I'm sorry, but you're all going to Hell. I apologize if I offend anyone." I mean come on. And I already made a point of saying that my ATs will not exceed 15mph(like 24.1 kph) And it's all in how you stand. Current rollerbladers can go and excess of 15mph and not fall. So get the facts and think before you speak. And no, I'm not even remotely phased by your comment. ATs WILL exist. Thank you and goodnight.

I was clocked going 65mph by a policeman.

[Bluemarine]

Bluemarine, you offend. You came into the WRONG forum to say crap like that. That's like going to a gay pride thing and saying. "I'm sorry, but you're all going to Hell. I apologize if I offend anyone." I mean come on. And I already made a point of saying that my ATs will not exceed 15mph(like 24.1 kph) And it's all in how you stand. Current rollerbladers can go and excess of 15mph and not fall. So get the facts and think before you speak. And no, I'm not even remotely phased by your comment. ATs WILL exist. Thank you and goodnight.

Errr well, I'm the kind of person who says it straight, Sorry I can't change ;), Going to a Gay Pride parade has nothing to do with what I was saying, I was talking out of logic, My opinions of if I like something or not is completely different then fact's, I said 30 - 40km like most people were implying, not 24.1km, Your obvious anger shows that yes you are phased by my comment, A-T's may exist in the near future 15 - 20 years but not it this day and age.

Bluemarine, I bet you would be one of those people who would have said "flying machines wouldn't work" a while back too. Just because its something new doesn't mean it can't happen. If you think the torque will knock you back, then how come going 60MPH on a motorcycle doesn't break your legs/any other part of you body. According to you, the force would cause you to fall off, right? Or if you don't fall off, the strain would surely break somehting, right?
Point being, don't go around telling people what they are doing is impossible, because even though it may seem that way to you, maybe not everyone else thinks the same, and discouraging innovation is always a bad thing.

Actually, Aerodynamics are completely different concerning flight that people did think it was possible, trying to stand up with the wind and force of gravity against you at high speeds is impossible for the body to withstand, I'm not saying that A-T's could never exist, just not now in this day and age. With a motorcycle you are in a different stance and behind an object breaking the wind, and on-top of something that isn't standing with muscles.. by all means they can try to make a working pair of A-T's and attempt to ride them, I'm just stating facts and my opinion, which I personally don't think is a bad thing. A forum is meant for discussion and opinion, excluding other peoples opinion because it isn't of your liking makes what you said completely idiotic. You obviously haven't rode a Motorcycle or had much experience with objects like Skateboards or Rollerblades to know anything about such a subject

Errr, Sorry if I Babbled >.<
Bluey~

[Eberwolf]

BLUEMARINE - Actually Bluemarine. I was laughing at you the entire time. And the gay thing was an A-N-A-L-O-G-Y. Sorry if I went too fast for you. LoL
Also, at my current rate of progress, my team is estimated to achieve this in 4 years-ish. And 15-20 years is still this day and age.

What are you? Some 13 year old trying to pretend to be smart? Aerodynamics are a part of Physics. LoL

Also, a forum about MAKING AIR TREKS, isn't for negative unhelpful people. It's for those interested in HELPING the PROGRESSION. Key words are fun, aren't they? LoL
When I go to the advanced technology expo, it's full of what? SUPPORTERS. Curious isn't it. LoL

I added LoLs so you understood my feelings. LoL

Oh, and if you think YOU could anger me, I laugh all the more at that. Why would words, with no face, no emotion, and no sense, upset me? LoL

I just feel a pessimist like you, has no right being her. hehe(thought I'd change it up a little) LoL

Goodbye lol
Wow.... lol is kinda fun

JAKKIN - That is frickin' SWEET!!

TENX - Yes we do.... lol

[Tenx]

well..
light90 said that he only wanted to achieve the high speed..
but.. i wonder what do u and ur team want to achieve?

and a lol comment... if u dont bother with blue's post... u dont need to answer him... that shows that he hits u in some point.. even a little.. lol.. dont be mad...

the both of u have said stupid things in ur last post... if u(eber) are really taking this seriously.. just discard the shit that u believe he said and pay attention to the important details that might be hidden in his critiques.

u know.. i dont hav a side in this whole discussion.. i just want to hav fun...
u know... make something like a pair of rollerblades with an engine is not a big deal... but how u're going to make a human handle it... this shall be fun... 24km/h is a ridiculous speed... i already got a lot more in my skate with not so much problem.... and with a few equips like helmets and stuff and dont aiming urself into a wall... well.. u should be ok...
but i still note... that make tricks at that speed... hmmm... that hurts.. xD hahahah

well.. anyways... what is ur objective with ur AT?

and pics pics pics /o/

[T.Y.]

They idea of making an AT like in Air Gear currently is impossible is it not? i mean come one a rollerblade that has a motor that can achive over 80 km/h? that's ridiculous!!! do you know how much power its going to take to make it run?! and what's the fuel or the cell going to be? gas is completely out of the question and the battery will run out of power as soon as it starts.

[Tenx]

actually T.Y
that kind of energy can be created... with nuclear energy...
for example...
this year.. was developed a nuclear battery with 30x30x30cm (not exactly)
that can provide eletrical energy to up 25.000 houses...
thats A LOT of energy..
of course that this is really expensive...
and that this cant be put into the AT... cause if in any case the nuclear capsule broke... the whole city die xD lol.....
but well.. in something like 20 years... the atomic energy can be in the point to generate positive energy. ^^....
and anywayz.. it is a pretty deadly to use ATs at that speed xD

but those guys seems to want to do a "fake AT"... xD to catch something like 24.1km/h

what else they want to do... is what im still guessing... xD

[Jakkin]

actually T.Y
that kind of energy can be created... with nuclear energy...
for example...
this year.. was developed a nuclear battery with 30x30x30cm (not exactly)
that can provide eletrical energy to up 25.000 houses...
thats A LOT of energy..
of course that this is really expensive...
and that this cant be put into the AT... cause if in any case the nuclear capsule broke... the whole city die xD lol.....
but well.. in something like 20 years... the atomic energy can be in the point to generate positive energy. ^^....
and anywayz.. it is a pretty deadly to use ATs at that speed xD

but those guys seems to want to do a "fake AT"... xD to catch something like 24.1km/h

what else they want to do... is what im still guessing... xD
I hope your not lumping me into the 24.1km/h group... I'm trying to just design a frame of At's that will be able to withstand the pressure of riding at 60-120mph for lengths of time... I'm unsure on the battery source or any of the rest of the mechanics involved for AT's to become a reality.

[Bluemarine]

BLUEMARINE - Actually Bluemarine. I was laughing at you the entire time. And the gay thing was an A-N-A-L-O-G-Y. Sorry if I went too fast for you. LoL
Also, at my current rate of progress, my team is estimated to achieve this in 4 years-ish. And 15-20 years is still this day and age.

What are you? Some 13 year old trying to pretend to be smart? Aerodynamics are a part of Physics. LoL

Also, a forum about MAKING AIR TREKS, isn't for negative unhelpful people. It's for those interested in HELPING the PROGRESSION. Key words are fun, aren't they? LoL
When I go to the advanced technology expo, it's full of what? SUPPORTERS. Curious isn't it. LoL

I added LoLs so you understood my feelings. LoL

Oh, and if you think YOU could anger me, I laugh all the more at that. Why would words, with no face, no emotion, and no sense, upset me? LoL

I just feel a pessimist like you, has no right being her. hehe(thought I'd change it up a little) LoL

Goodbye lol
Wow.... lol is kinda fun

You obviously do take this into offense, making some random troll tick you off is obvious in your post, How about I start with a moronic lol post by laughing at your projected 4 years ?


What are you? Some 13 year old trying to pretend to be smart?
Obviously I don't need to with people like you around to soften my potential image of intelligence Aerodynamics are a part of Physics. LoL *Looks for :facepalm e-mote*

Also, a forum about MAKING AIR TREKS, isn't for negative unhelpful people. It's for those interested in HELPING the PROGRESSION
*Looks at a lol post, after looking at a gay joke post*

So wait, me looking at the forum to look at the download section and coming by said thread, is compared to going to a tech expo?

Your post is born of fail, You made yourself look like even more of an idiot

[miniii]

This is only a thread, not a whole forum too, unless you were referring to another forum which I am unaware of, but didn't mention anywhere in your posts.
But goo luck on the AT, some pics could be good too.
Very interested if it looks like the ones in the manga >.<
And nuclear energy in ATs?
I think they'll use that for gundams lol, not ATs >.>

[rasenshuriken]

This is only a thread, not a whole forum too, unless you were referring to another forum which I am unaware of, but didn't mention anywhere in your posts.
But goo luck on the AT, some pics could be good too.
Very interested if it looks like the ones in the manga >.<
And nuclear energy in ATs?
I think they'll use that for gundams lol, not ATs >.>

lols if they used nuclear energy for AT's that'd be one big feat. its alot harder to control all that radioactivity and all the other stuff used in the nuclear thingy than say to use an external battery.;p

[lightning90]

oookay.. this isn't going to be a fight thread right?

i do aim for high speed. but i still know that something built must have it's base.
we start slow but fast enough, then we improve it in anyway we can.

everything is possible nowadays. except for lightsabers and light speed/hyperspace jump which require alot more researching.

with the right calculations, the right mechanism, the right parts, it can happen.


even if you don't believe it can happen, you don't need to post it here.
it's like a vegetarian went into a butcher house and tell the butcher "i don't eat meat" and get out. so the butcher is like "wtf?". you want to make fun of this thread or say it's impossible, make another thread like "ATs is impossible".

i'm not smart, but i'm not an idiot either. if this wont work, let me find out by myself after my hardwork failed again and again. still, we learn from mistakes.

why am i babbling here? nvm..

nuke power batteries? sweet. but the risk is huge. unless those who make it figured out a way to decrease the risk into next to none, that'll be great. one can only wish...or make it by oneself.

[Eberwolf]

lightning90 on target as always. Anyways, Bluemarine, I apologize for my attitude. And I apologize to everyone who read it. I admit it upset me, obviously. I just thought it was inappropriate. I apologize for being rude, however, I still feel it is inappropriate.
-------------------------------
On to why I'm on here. Once again, the frame couldn't withstand the output. It cracked slightly after 4 hours of nonstop running. I'm shooting for 12 hours nonstop. Unfortunately, I'll be taking a temporary hiatus. I'm getting overwhelmed with school, and my wife is working out of town, so I only see her on the weekend. Add my kid on top of that, and I'm out of my mind. So, I'm moving to live close to my wife's work. Hopefully, this will make things easier, allowing me to continue my work. Unfortunately, my "lab"(mwahahahaha) won't be coming with me. I'm in an apartment, meaning I'll only be able to work at school. Which I can only go to on days I have class. Thus my 4 year estimate is more like 10 now, maybe 12. Pray for me lol.

[lightning90]

thanks eber. i admit, even i pissed of by the post of repeated "it's impossible" but i already gotten use to it. come on. that one is like the 48th "it's impossible"
i've read.
------------

so we need more sturdy material right? the frame must be light and durable. if only diamond is as cheap as scrap metal, we wont have much probs. except molding it...<---not sleeping gave me stupid ideas...

sturdy material and light weight.. some body on mangaupdates mention about carbon nano-tubes.durable and light weight.but where do we even get one of those?

[Tenx]

u know... i cant avoid coming here xD... it is the most interesting topic...
i can always laugh a little with the flames...
anywayz...
not wanting to help.. but.. not want to bother either...
u know.. why dont u use carbon fibber? it is much more young! why do u need something like carbon nanotubes? of course that it is amazingly strong... but that is good for swords...
carbon fibber is enough strong for the frame and its incredible light...

light... if u die without achieving an AT... i wonder what will go through ur mind xD.. or if u find by urself its impossible... xD

eber... can u please tell me what kind of AT do u wanna achieve?
cause ur goal seems to be a bit different form light's


and its impossible... (i cant resist! hAuAHaU lol)

[lightning90]

nano-tubes good for swords? then maybe i made the frame extra sharp for battle. j/k

carbon fiber huh? thanks for the thought.

the way you say it's impossible, i'm not mad at all. coz you're not in the way. and you did gave me something. so i took it as a joke.

my goal is to make the safe/and slow for a start. then make it faster. let say 60-70 kph. then make it a sport. that'll be a long way to go, but dreaming and aiming isn't wrong.

i think eber is planning for safer version of AT. ya' know, no blood splattering on the road.

if i die before AT happens, i'll haunt somebody to make it happen. then i'll leave for another world.

i already find it impossible, before. then i met this whole bunch of guys, and i made a thread for it. then, the "im" just got erased. leaving "possible" in my head.

[miniii]

Hey, I didn't think of the nuclear energy, someone mentioned it before me >.<
Oh~ and how about fibre glass?
It's quite easy to make mouldings out of it, although I am totally lost on the whole procedure on making this.

[lightning90]

i'm waiting for feedback from the guys. is fiber glass durable enough?

need to find a mold shop. and some jobs. i'm broke. just spent my last cash on cigarette.
just in case where do we get carbon nano-tubes?

[Tenx]

carbon nano tubes are utlra high new technology..
the only place with lower tech u can find nano tubes are in some lengendary broadswords(no not the samurai swords) they are the famous damascus swords... but the process to make them is lost... so the scientist cant believe that nano tubes exist in such pre historic item xD lol

the mokugome(this is a samurai sword xD) is close to the damascus.. but it isnt one.. xD its like a fake hahahaha *joke* (dont hav nanotubes)

nano tubes are found/made in/with nanotechs.. (ooooh xD).. so... u cant buy it at any corner... and it is still pretty new tech... i dont know if there is any product already using it...

i believe glass fiber cant support the frame... it can be used for the shape.. but... its better use some polymer (the gay name of plastic haahha)

the impossible were a joke... with a bit of reality hauAHauh..
acctually.. i dont really mind.. if it is possible or not... i already told ya what i think..

and

its impossible... get used to it xD lol

[miniii]

I think fibre glass would be durable enough.
But i just looked up wiki just then not good in humid conditions apparently, creates microscopic cracks etc.
And as long as you don't pour chemicals over it, i think it should be fine for the frame...
But hey, i'm only 17, just sharing ideas lol.

[lightning90]

fiber glass on the foot, break into pieces, = 1000 splinter in your foot.

just telling you why can't use it.

nobody logs into the forums yet. so no feedback.
still waiting

[miniii]

Oh ye, never thought of that lol.
How stupid am i >.<

[Eberwolf]

Okay, I contacted my "guy" about carbon fiber. He said he'd see if he can get a hold of some. I must admit I feel stupid for not thinking of it myself. Also, the ATs I'm designing are so far are almost exactly like the ones in Air Gear, and can go 15 mph without kicking. So with pressure alone and a weight to emulate a person. The brake doesn't work yet lol. Once the brake is working we wanna run a test run. This is assuming that we get a working shell. And then I'll post on a video on YouTube and give the link here. Hopefully carbon fiber works. I'm not liking the frame we just got. And I'm gonna test it before I leave. My last day with internet. Sigh. It's gonna suck. Oh well, catch you guys later.

[jihaeng29]

wow i feel so noob (i guess i am haha still 14) wow u guys r rly on track. I wish u good luck and i want to AT!! yay. I cant do much but i found a website that sells carbon nanotubes and it seems pretty good. http://www.dynanonic.com/sdc_products_cnts.htm#SWCNTs

sorry i cant be more of a help

[Tenx]

holy f0ckin shet!
15 $ EACH! omg!!!
5$ for over than 5kg!
mega lol...
it would cost like 30k $ one AT xD

[Seriesta]

holy f0ckin shet!
15 $ EACH! omg!!!
5$ for over than 5kg!
mega lol...
it would cost like 30k $ one AT xD

lol. Look on the bright side, purchase more than 5000 mg and the price is "negotiable". >_< '

Why hasn't eber and lightning been posting ?? I want to know what's going on, progress and etc.. Hope everything is going smoothly. Wish I could be of better help but I don't have a clue about physics..:(

[lightning90]

sorry for not been posting for so long ^ ^
eber is moving so he wont be able to log on for awhile. or so he says ^ ^
now we divide the task to three division. 1st, focus on RL calculation, the weight,force and physics stuff. 2nd focus on cover, internal & external design, material cost, and how that will affect overall cost. 3rd focus on the engine/motor design(since we didn't found any motor that powerful enough..yet).

i'm too busy looking for works..so not much time to be online..
i'll keep this thread up-2-date ^ ^...if there's any update that is ^ ^

[darkpaul181]

Yo!, so much time....:), sorry guys but i don't have anymore ideas, i'm just searching for the motor and trying to find something about brakes...still no results found...:(
but i will continue to search something....
hope the AT plan get alive!!:)

see ya!...

[saniya]

i would love to see it happen nothing impossible just need ppl to get into it who knows after few years we might have real ATs um but this is risky for the body as well so ppl might back out too since tht much pressure on the body isnt tht possible and tht also without any gagets on to protect ur body...lets hope this dream comes alive because i know we can always come wid different things alittle modifications and it might really be possibe...gud luck:P

[alterbuu]

an electric motor with about 750 watts has about 1hp with is good enough to push a 200lb person at about 2-3mph and max 5-6 for an unknown duration and I still don't know how much damage it does to the motor. these are the figures I came up with when I first watched airgear. if you ever wanted to know what tech support does off a call well this it. I was trying a rollerball config instead to see if it worked better it doesn't. also each wheel would need its own motor and a timing cpu. as far as power transfer direct is the best but a 40/60 divison between the wheels it should improve the handling while removing the need for a brake system you would just have to stop by pulling a spitfire but eventually there will be better ways but for right now just trying to get investors. I hope this info helps.

[Sendo]

omfg... if you guys managed to even make somthing anything like A.T... I could find many investor for you.. even if its dangerus, some people would do anything for the sky

but there would be nothing like the regalia tho.. or the flame road..

[lightning90]

we need a motor with 2hp..and i think there's 3hp motor..and using 2 motor(if possible) on each AT(left and right of course) would be sufficient..

somebody else made the calculations.. and i'm bad with physic..so i can't explain it briefly.. sorry..

[alterbuu]

omfg... if you guys managed to even make somthing anything like A.T... I could find many investor for you.. even if its dangerus, some people would do anything for the sky

but there would be nothing like the regalia tho.. or the flame road..


there would be eventually but that comes later. and it would fall under the xtreme sports category. it being xmas I was with some friends one of which his nephew got a r/c car. it oes about 35mph non-scaled. the online real concern I have is the battery life. it only ran for 25min. but it was really low on noise.

[bigal78]

/activate math mode:
One horsepower = 33,000 lb-ft / one minute. A horse exerting 1 horsepower can raise 330 pounds of coal 100 feet in a minute, or 33 pounds of coal 1,000 feet in one minute, or 1,000 pounds 33 feet in one minute. It doesn't really matter, just as long as the two factors(pounds and feet) equal 33,000. because those 3 different variations will not work...we need to obviously change these to figure out how much horsepower is needed to lift an x-weighted person a y distance. now keep in mind that it won't be directly lifting an x-weighted person, as this person will be on wheels, and therefore we will need slightly less horsepower to push an x-weighted person than if her/she were just standing. yay friction.

This way is using proportions to check with the math in the following paragraph:
According to wikipedia.com, An automobile engine produces mechanical energy at a rate of 25,000 watts (approximately 30 horsepower) while cruising(i'm assuming they either mean 60mph(don't know the km/h), or the car is moving at a constant speed).
Now a Honda Civic weighs close to 3,000 pounds...an assuming that while cruising it's engine produces 25,000 watts, a 150 pound person (a mere five percent of the said 3000 pound car) should only need 1250 watts to "cruise". Its just an estimate, because it is a calculation of a "cruise" which is not a definate value, and i am using values from two different sources, so it may be off. Also, 1250 watts is about 1.7 horsepower for those who are wondering. (this one is most likely off as it is using "cruising speed".)

(This is more likely to be more accurate as I am using real values)
Hm, we would like to move 10-15 mph, and move 150lb person. Again, one horsepower = 33,000 lb-ft / one minute.
So x horsepower(s) = 150lb * 880 feet(ten miles per minute) / one minute.
x horsepower(s) = 132 000 lb-ft / one minute.
Because one horsepower is 33,000 lb-ft / one minute
We need is 4 horsepower, exactly, to move a 150 pound human 10mph, if my math is done correctly, and that doesn't factor in friction and wind resistance(because obviously if the wind is blowing 50mph in your face you'll be going backwords, lol)
Now doing the same math, except for 15 mph, we come out with
x horsepower(s) = 198 000 lb-ft / one minute, or
exactly 6, lol. Strange how these values are exact numbers...weird.
So by my math, we need a 4-6horsepower engine to push a 150 pound human, now obviously this engine would go a lot faster on smaller people (weighing ~100lbs), and a lot slower on larger people (weighing ~200lbs).

So like lightning90 said, so a 2-3 horsepower should work, as you would take my values divided by 2, as we are using two motors. Hurray for backing up outside info.

Great, now my head hurts from math :(
edit: wow, just noticed my post is humongous.

[lightning90]

nice calculations. i'm afraid that some ppl may think i faked the 2-3 hp stuff. then you made the calculations. thx XD

[bigal78]

Lol, and after making a quick google search on those engines, they're just a little too big haha. About 75% of what I found was boat engines, for smaller boats, and the rest I found were about 8 inches in diameter, so the choice has to be a custom motor being built, or I'm not searching hard enough.

[lightning90]

everyone's thinking of "homemade" motors.. but i myself didn't know whether it can be done or no..

[bigal78]

Well it'd have to be, as to my knowledge there are no motors of that spec in the size needed. It wouldn't have to be homemade though, you might be able to get a professional motor company to make one for you, if its possible, and if it is, it would be terribly expensive to develop, being as there are none on the general market.

[alterbuu]

Well it'd have to be, as to my knowledge there are no motors of that spec in the size needed. It wouldn't have to be homemade though, you might be able to get a professional motor company to make one for you, if its possible, and if it is, it would be terribly expensive to develop, being as there are none on the general market.

if you google build dc motor you can find a real basic design but it gives a good idea of how the motors work. all we need to do is up the power and change it so the magnet is in the center and it rotates around it. also this means we could build the motor as part of the wheel. i would have posted the link but i am using my ppc.

[FMB-24]

Making real AT's are you crazy man.

[dabid]

go for gold man

[kunhime]

This is how you build air treks.

Step 1: Build a time machine
Step 2: Go to the future
Step 3: Steal Air Trecks
Step 4: Go back in time
Step 5: Copy Design
Step 6: Done.

[bigal78]

Or you could do my very special plan:
Step 1: Think about how it would be done.
Step 2: Is it possible? Why or why not.
Step 3: How to make it possible.
I like mine better :)

[lightning90]

kunhime,do you exactly know how time machine works?

i'd appreciate it if you don't voice your jokes here..

now that somebody posted the link to the site in wikipedia... the sites been running with leechers... took the posted ideas to try with their idea..and never post some new ideas back..

[jihaeng29]

hey lightning90, what is the address for the AT project website? im not very smart so i havent been able to help out but... I had it before but my computer broke down...

[lightning90]

already sent it to you by pm...

[Seriesta]

hey lightning90, what is the address for the AT project website? im not very smart so i havent been able to help out but... I had it before but my computer broke down...

0.o.... there's an AT website? For someone(myself) who is so obsessed in having ATs, yet didn't know about any AT website...:(
Can someone tell me too,please?

I'll love to help out in any way I can.

[Eberwolf]

Hey guys. I'm back. Anyone miss me?
Anywho, I went into the workshop yesterday to see my buds and they informed me that we burnt out the motors on the last test. So we're screwed in the sense that we can't get those motors again(this is probably for the best as I'm still unsure of how legal they were). :*( So I went out and got shitfaced with the guys. I decided to come on here and I see motor discussion, so now I'm hopeful of the future. Anyways, we aren't giving up. We just have to find another way.

[mmcr13]

making ats it kinda simple just get a pair of inline skates take two wheels off[the middle one] u need motors and stuff like that but u need to have some real phone numbers to get them

[-Seika-]

@ mmcr13 - If you think trying to find motors that are like the sizes of in-line skate wheels are "easy", you're sadly mistaken... And I'm not talking of those puny toy motors that move at like 1 mph... but more of an actual motor that'll be enough to move a person forward at 10~20+mph... It's not easy at all, but actually really effing hard =.=; To everyone on the A-T making team, GL and Go for Gold :]

[mmcr13]

lol i never said they were easy but if u wanta simple one just to get the form of an ATs a little not really then u can use that im on the at project forums

[rasenshuriken]

well they got those small motors that are the size of ure palm, they spin 3000 rpm and can lift the weight of an adult with ease. I'm not sure what its called but i saw it on Mythbusters lol when they used it to rappel up a 20ft wall if you can find that ep.

[-Seika-]

Lol Rassy that's pretty crazy, but if it's on like Mythbusters, and has like 3000rpm, I think it would be over... a loooot of money $_$;; Would be pretty cool if someone were to take that engine, and completely pimp it out, and only added like 1~2 cm to the diameter... O_O
AGAIN,

GL A-T MAKING TEAM!!

[lightning90]

making ats it kinda simple just get a pair of inline skates take two wheels off[the middle one] u need motors and stuff like that but u need to have some real phone numbers to get them

i've said it once before.. it'll ended up nothing more but modified skates..
besides, the mechanism is much to complex to "fit" into inline skates..

we have to start from scratch ...as in frame,cover, redo it all..
after we get the right motor and all parts are secure and functional in it's place, we make a frame to fit it in.. then the cover so it doesn't look like crap..

@eber: good to see you back ^ ^
though tough luck on the motor..

[Eberwolf]

We're still gonna rock this out. We will be successful.

[mmcr13]

if only we new each part of the AT all we need is the money and the place to find it

[bigal78]

i've said it once before.. it'll ended up nothing more but modified skates..
besides, the mechanism is much to complex to "fit" into inline skates..

we have to start from scratch ...as in frame,cover, redo it all..
after we get the right motor and all parts are secure and functional in it's place, we make a frame to fit it in.. then the cover so it doesn't look like crap..

@eber: good to see you back ^ ^
though tough luck on the motor..

Well I'm sure it'd be fine to do that in the beginning, just to make sure it'll work, because if we can get modified inlines to works, then optimizing it w/ all custom-made parts would be the only work left. It'd be a waste to go ahead and make the "finish product" stuff before you know whether or not the project can be finished itself. Of course some parts will have to be custom in the first place, its not as easy as just putting engines on skates (or it shouldn't be).

[saniya]

hows the progress goin gotten started on sth??hope ur successful;)

[Nikku]

I haven't seen any legitimate evidence of parts being bought for this yet. I'm very sceptical.

[Tenx]

since they working in this for real... and its not homemade stuff...
im sure u guys know that this cant be released before 2012
cause.... man.... u guys dont even hav an motor....
and...
thats just a very small detail on the whole thing...

did u guys already started to think what u are gonna do about the license form O!G bout it?.... this can bring ur playground to the hell...

... if u guys are serious bout this.. there are lots of other issues to be taken care of than just the " mechatronic" (mecaninc + eletronic xD)
and.. i can see that u guys are SURE that this thing will work out...


:D

*oh yes.. i luv this topic *

[mmcr13]

theres another place working on this too and there working on a prototype

[yzak47]

Hello

I'm actually an amateur engineer and I've been researching how to create/develop/ and market, something similar to A-T.

It lacks The "JUMP" capability but has the speed,
It is also not very clunky at all, It is larger than a standers Rollerblade, but that is to be expected. I already found a few manufacturers that can create the motors to the small specifications and battery packs small enough. It's a lot more complicated then it sounds to engineer this thing. Only thing I have left is to figure out how to make the cost below $1200 (Manufacture cost).

If you are interested or want in on the project email me at: spartan11747@hotmail.com

[HurricaneRoad]

but if the AT was build in the real world i think it could have a bright future.. because there is allready sports around the world with inline in it (they arent that big but they still is there).. but i think it would take a couple of years to manage building just one..

[bigal78]

As for the people who made "Air Gear", I'd say that they can't really sue unless they hold a patent on actually making it, as its possible to advertise them as "motorized inlines", rather than Air Trecks lol, and probably more wise to do so. If these were to come into existance, a large sport would most likely rise from it, but there would have to be plenty of time to put ample amounts of safety on these, else they'd be illegal, haha.

Just as long as the design isn't mostly a ripoff from the series, and has plenty of originality to it, there would be no problem with lawsuits as far as I can see.

[Eberwolf]

My team is just gonna build them and then get all the other stuff. Just because a finished product getting a patent is more likely than a concept getting one. And as for Oh!Great... idk... lol... but I don't really care either. I know we'll work something out.

[lightning90]

eber. i forgot to ask. before, you say the fame you made crack after four hours of runs. what material did you use?

[Eberwolf]

I forget, but I go back into town today, so I'll ask and get back to you asap.

[lightning90]

i'll be waiting ^ ^

[zalyn]

This is cool.....though I did find a gasoline powered skate here
http://ykstart.en.alibaba.com/product/50363397/51593456/skyrunner_power_shoes/Gasoline_Roller_Skating_Shoes.html
they also have some other toys,,maybe take a look at the basic engine specs?

[Wonderboy]

I suggest that there should only be two wheels and larger than the normal one. and in the space in the middle of the two wheels is where the motor should be, just a suggestion :)

[Eberwolf]

That's kinda how mine is, Wonderboy. Which reminds me, Lightning, my friend said that the frame was just a tempered steel frame. Also, the team has temporarily disbanded. Two of them are in another country atm. When they get back, we'll start back up.

[mad333]

the cost of developing an AT would go to milions and millions of $$$$$$$$.
i think if u get da supoet of MIT and IIT u might be able to make it if 10 years.
when ever u made it i am one of da first persons to buy it and by da way it needs to be powered by nuclear cells. lololololol

[Eberwolf]

ITT is helping me produce it.... sorta.... at least a couple of the teachers. And I will have a patent very soon. Since my schematics are complete, all I need is the cash for the patent.
Then I'll start a actual public production. Things are going well.

[rasenshuriken]

ITT is helping me produce it.... sorta.... at least a couple of the teachers. And I will have a patent very soon. Since my schematics are complete, all I need is the cash for the patent.
Then I'll start a actual public production. Things are going well.

awesome, cant wait to see the pics ^^
good luck with it

[Eberwolf]

Thanks rasen

[lightning90]

ITT is helping me produce it.... sorta.... at least a couple of the teachers. And I will have a patent very soon. Since my schematics are complete, all I need is the cash for the patent.
Then I'll start a actual public production. Things are going well.

really dude? cool.. just an estimation from you, how long do think it'll take?

[Eberwolf]

Maybe the year, to actually receive the patent.... apparently processing is a long tedious process.
Production, maybe another year.
Just guestimates mind you.

[mmcr13]

uh i need the link to the AT project cause my comp got wiped out thats y i havent beeen on

[Sky_so_high]

http://www.cosplay.com/showthread.php?t=90588

On page 4 I posted an idea that came to my head and the results... which iiis

http://www.cosplay.com/showthread.php?t=90588

They aren't perfectly like ATs but it's the closest I can go in this situation, hope it helps.

EDIT: Haha woops, I just read the conversation going on, this is basically for cosplay purpose not.. actually shoving a motor in it and making it work xD

[mmcr13]

lightning pm it to me plz

[Wonderboy]

pm the link to me too please, I would like to see the project too. Im very much interested

[.zombie]

Not sure if this has been said yet, but I'd like to point something out:
Wouldn't it be impossible for real world ATs to even match the speed of the Air Gear ATs? If thats true, you wouldn't be able to do wallrides or legit tricks, and that's no fun TT, didn't mean to be a downer, I've just been talking with my friends about this for quite some time.

In any case, I pray that ATs become reality!

[Eberwolf]

Just for society's information.... A wallride is easy, I can wallride going like 10 mph.... the ATs I am getting patented can go 15 mph with a rider at 150 pounds, from idle. Thus 15 mph with no pushing(kicking). Which gets a lot of potential. Also, inline skaters can go 35 mph (maybe more) and keep control. :P Just FYI. Danger is in the hand of the user. A knife can be a tool or a weapon, not merely a weapon.

[lightning90]

nyeh~ i'm too lazy to rewrite my bike/race/illegal metaphor(?) stuff again.

so i'm just gonna say eber is right. danger depends on the riders. eber gave the example of already dangerous tool.

i'll just give " vase if for decoration. but somebody just hit me with one coz i go out with his girlfriend. "

i'm blank!! even as admin i'm just as useless..

[.zombie]

Forgive me for not being specific, I meant wallrides as in the type that Buccha can do, or straight up the side of a building.

[Eberwolf]

OOOOOH, well that's improbable anyways.

[Artcore]

Im looking at a mechanical engineering degree, and so is one of my friends. This is a great idea, someting wed both eat up. Maybe we'll come up with something... Ill talk to him about it.

[.zombie]

Improbable yes, impossible no, I failed to mention that me and two of my friends (both named Takeuchi Sora -weirddddd-) along with two teachers make a 2 pairs of A-Ts, one resembled the pair Agito wears (minus spikey wheels), and the others were Spit Fire's, ANYWAY, we discovered that they could match 17 mph but the wheels broke five minutes later, the fang (ones I used) were durable, and probably would've been a good thing to play with more but I tried to be like Agito and went 25 mph, and fell flat on my ass. What I learned is that fangs don't slash, they explode, and it hurts. Anyway, I'd have to ask what they were made of (I was just the guinea pig) but I think I can find out, would that help this project?

[Artcore]

ya, it would. like a ton. if you can get specs and a reasonably priced parts list i can whip em up and churn em out. i love this kind of thing.

[Eberwolf]

Well, I'm already trying for a patent. It's a long and tedious process. But every bit of imformation helps.

[Artcore]

then youve made some? you got specs?

[Eberwolf]

Sorta... I won't post them until the patent goes through though.... It's a temporary patent, and assuming I build a pair it'll become a permanent patent.

[Artcore]

so youre applying for a patent on a product you havent built?
good luck.

[Eberwolf]

They're giving me the benefit of the doubt. Thus the temporary one and not the permanent.

[Artcore]

ah, ok then. good luck with that.

@ zombie
id still really appreciate those specs. Id love to get on this and make some.

[.zombie]

ah, ok then. good luck with that.

@ zombie
id still really appreciate those specs. Id love to get on this and make some.

They wont let me have the specs >> They said I'd do something stupid like the time I tried to build an Evangelion.....

[Eberwolf]

HAHA..... Nice zombie. Freakin' awesome. You own.

[.zombie]

Big dreams, big IQ, low mechanical skill. I'm trying to get my friend Sora (god I hate that name) to give me his copy of the Leviathan specs ^^

[kishagi]

it would be awesome to make at's, (ive been thinkin bout it 4 a while) but wouldnt it be too dangerous with that kind of speed and power especailly after seeing what ikki and his friends had to go thruough just to win. plus if people started a parts war type thing, many would die due to reckless actions or gang rivalry and disputes nad many would die in accidents

but even tho its a good idea, just keep it off the mainstream market

also how did u get those specs?

[.zombie]

it would be awesome to make at's, (ive been thinkin bout it 4 a while) but wouldnt it be too dangerous with that kind of speed and power especailly after seeing what ikki and his friends had to go thruough just to win. plus if people started a parts war type thing, many would die due to reckless actions or gang rivalry and disputes nad many would die in accidents

but even tho its a good idea, just keep it off the mainstream market

also how did u get those specs?

No one could possibly do the stunts in AG, well, unless they were in Zero G, then it's possible, but that's like only if you wanna be a poser like Kilik. And never, ever, ever, ever, never, ever, say keep Air Trek off the mainstream, we NEED them, it's a dream come true for AG junkies Xp

[Artcore]

lol ya it is. just dont try to ride up the wall of your school XD

Why wont they give you specs? I mean, you said, but is that it? Have them post it on here themselves. Seriously, Id really like to see em.

[.zombie]

Artcore, I'm a very irresponsible guy, I mean really, I tried to build an EVA, but don't worry, Sora will get the specs for me, it might take some time though since his father recently passed away.

[Artcore]

that sucks... well let me know what happens.

btw, Im in texas too, where are there 2 kids named sora takeguchi in texas?

[Seijuro]

you realize actually making skate like in the manga is improbably to even be possible 100 years from now. you have big iq you should know wallriding up a wall like buccha does is illogical from any standpoint.

[Artcore]

lol were not trying to wallride, just make some basic motorized roller skates. not like were trying to do all the stuff in the manga :p

[.zombie]

lol were not trying to wallride, just make some basic motorized roller skates. not like were trying to do all the stuff in the manga :p

Hey, I'm gonna wallride, I came close once, I can do it again. Anyway, still trying to get the specs >>

[Artcore]

well ya, but not like up a buiding XD
i mean you can wallride on just about anything with wheels, (skateboard for example) but were not gonna like go jump buildings with these

[.zombie]

well ya, but not like up a buiding XD
i mean you can wallride on just about anything with wheels, (skateboard for example) but were not gonna like go jump buildings with these
Maybe you're not, but I am! Btw, Sora says the "body" was a steel/kevlar hybrid thingy..

[Artcore]

ah, well let me just get into my spare bulletproof vests and mold it with some steel...
any way to reduce costs and still keep good durability?

[Eberwolf]

I may just go with that actually. That should work quite well. If you don't mind, that is.

[Artcore]

well ya its gonna have a great strength:weight ratio, but I mean where would you get that?

[.zombie]

Hell if I know, I tested them and helped design the stuff but I didn't put it together, I basically just gave them the shape and they made it. But if that would work for the body, go for it.

[jihaeng29]

umm if lightning90 is still around... I was wondering y the AT project website is down for so long -_-;;; is there a problem?

Eberwolf, you got a patent? wow...

[Eberwolf]

Yeah, hopefully I get them assembled in the next month, or the temporary patent ends. We'll see.

[Ringo]

Well,I too hope someone makes real Air Trek,but it'd be a little dangerous and I bet expensive.Now I wish I was good at physics,maths and so on.

[Kurokawa Shun]

I have given the whole "make real ATs" and I think that I have come up with a realistic solution. While making a motor, engine, switch, brake, and other things would be expensive, fragile, and heavy. there is another unconcidered option.
What I am talking about is a flywheel. A flywheel is the kind of technology that is usually equated with McDonald's happy meal toys. When you get a car out of your happy meal and you push it a few times along the table then it has enough speed to move on its own.
What happens is when the wheel is turned quickly, it spins a heavier wheel on the interior of the toy. Then after the interior wheel is spinning at sufficent speed the toy can be put on the ground. The momentum of the interior wheel allows the outer wheel to move the toy forward.
As you can see the application for a future AT would be quite similar. While you couldn't move without work on your own part. The more you work the faster you would go without a cap on your top speed. Also you would be able to maintain speed after you stop pushing.
An idea that I recently had to improve the flywheel is to couple it with a kind of inverse rotational break. Having two weights that slide back and forth along a diameter of the flywheel. A spring would be used to pull the weights back into the center of the flywheel. When the wheel speeds up the weights would push out and store energy in the centripital acceleration. If a rider was to stop pushing, the weights would move into the center of the wheel and increase the speed of the wheel.
Then you could also use a series of different sized weights to work like a transmission in a car. A heavier weight would allow for a maxiumum speed when not pushing, but a lighter weight would allow for a greater initial acceleration.
As you can see it is not really like the AT's of the Air Gear series, but it is a step in the right direction and it is cost effective and effiecent to use.

Please feel free to PM me if you have any questions about the system.
I will try and post a diagram soon.
PEACE
shun
ps I hope this is what Lightning90 was looking for

[Artcore]

thats a good point, except that the wheels would have to turn the same way. correct me if im wrong, but i believe taht those work partially off of a tension system where pulling them back creates the tension and then it is released forwards.
If you coudl switch it around so that you could have a continuous cycle, then youve got a good idea there.

[quastar]

I like the idea of this thread - while personally I think it's still far off for an average Air Gear fan to actually come out with a working prototype of a mechanical-based inline skate for whatever reason that was mentioned, I believe that people who are tech ethusiast, in the tertiary education level, engineering and mechanical industry, or people who have lots of money to employ these kind of people, might have a slight better chance at getting things right... but It's a long way to go, I presume.

I support the initiative, even when it seems to be impossible, at least the knowledge gained from the attempt to understand the workings and the limitations of current technology will be invaluable. So, all the best, and I shall follow this thread with an in-depth interest.

If I want to help with it, I can only do so after the prototype actually exists - as a beta tester (a bit of experience with inline skating and ice skating) :P - or in the area of computer science. :)

[Kurokawa Shun]

HAHAHAHAHA! Victory is mine!!!!!
Before I regail you with my latest breakthrough, Artcore, you are getting your happy meal toys confuzed. unstead of pulling back and storing potential energy in the spring (ei tension), you would push forward and store kenetic energy in the weighted flywheel.
So onto my victory...
HollowKing and I were talking about how the flywheel wouldn't work because the gyroscopic motion would impede the turning process. Well after thinking hard about it I have come up with a solution.
Instead of having a conventional flywheel that is parrallel with the regular wheels, you could change the angle on the flywheel (ie perpendicular or at a 45 degree angle). Changing the angle allows for the wheel to continue moving with the force of the flywheel, while the gyroscope doesn't interfer with the turing motion. (think my english sucked there but you have to see it to understand) I will have some diagrams up shortly.
PEACE
shun

[Eberwolf]

That's ingenius Shun! Great idea. I'll stick with my motorized versions. But still, that is fabulous.

[JimmyTbh]

I wouldnt mind just having Blades that looked like AT. Rollerblades can get pretty fast anyway, I think if you wana do anything just take the Rollerblade and improve it. Now i miss speed skating ... im gna go buy some blades :(

[Kurokawa Shun]

I have done it again.
After having a brief chat with my AP Physics teacher he brought to my attention the fact that you would only need to have two gyroscopes going opposite directions and there effects would be cancelled out. So you get the effect of the flywheels without the problems incountered when turning!
So you could easily place another gear in the sytem to turn one of the fly wheels around and create the desired effect.
HAHA take that Hollowking!
PEACE
shun

[yzak47]

This is so Easy, MAking an AT will Cost u $1200 on avarage Motors are here "http://www.micromo.com/" or go to Global Tech and get a custom order, Buy a battert kit to go with it, and use a presure matt for the control scheme. Geez I've designed the whole thing (It's slightly more complicated then I've made it seem) but still. Do some reasearch for crist sake, if u want AT. If u are desprate u can make an AT by taking apart a power Drill. So There Lazy OTAKU Get to work.

[Artcore]

This is so Easy, MAking an AT will Cost u $1200 on avarage Motors are here "http://www.micromo.com/" or go to Global Tech and get a custom order, Buy a battert kit to go with it, and use a presure matt for the control scheme. Geez I've designed the whole thing (It's slightly more complicated then I've made it seem) but still. Do some reasearch for crist sake, if u want AT. If u are desprate u can make an AT by taking apart a power Drill. So There Lazy OTAKU Get to work.

Dude, back down. were coming up with our own way to make them, not just trying to buy someone elses. its like a communtiy project of sorts. So quit trolling (albeit mild). If you dont like us that much then go somewhere else, theres plenty of other forums on this internet.

[yzak47]

I just Got tired of all the people saying it's impossible. And about "making your own" since when are u Electrical engineering factory production owners? Anyway No harm intended I just dislike Haters that say stuffs impossible.